Monday+April+4th

We want to welcome Liz Davis, Kristine Crane, and Ivan Fleischman as our Knowledgeable Others. Kristine has a background in English Literature and Library Science. Liz's background is English/Creative Writing and Library Information Science. Both are currently working librarians. Dr. Fleischman is a clinical psychologist who works with children, adolescents, and adults. We appreciate your sharing your knowledge and expertise.

As I was going through the 4th and 5th grade reading standards, I began to wonder if our students have trouble differentiating between topics, themes, and main ideas.

I am attaching some developmental reading skill steps that apply to main idea. Also, I went though both the 4th and 5th grade SSS and highlighted where direct references are made to finding the main idea and sumarizing the information. I underlined the 5th grade standards where they deviate from the 4th. It is evident, that many gaps will be the results if students do not understand main idea by 4th grade.



Hello to all...thanks for inviting me to be part of this study group. I'm afraid I'll be learning more from you than you will from me. Knowing that I am a psychologist and college teacher, how do you want me to participate and contribute to this process? If you could direct me to particular content that you want some feedback on or particular issues you would like me to address as a psychologist.....such structure would be quite helpful. Ivan

Ivan Our language team is comprised of every grade level. We all agree that it is difficult for our students to find the main idea. They get confused with the topic and theme. If our goal is summarizing, main idea is key. At this point of our study we are focused on researching what knowledge children need to have before they can attempt to understand the main idea. We are also scouring the standards, at each level, to see the expectations and to find gaps, if any. We are creating a developmental story for main idea. We are looking for developmental knowledge. Right up your alley!

Welcome Saundra Murray, middle school language arts teacher!

Kip What great notes, thanks Kip! What I notice is that the terms, wording, and approach are all the same for each year and every benchmark. I think this all grows meaningless and empty and they lose grasp with the concept instead of it solidifying and becoming second nature over time. Not to mention just getting plain sick of these words: main idea, relevant and supporting details, examples, summarizing... I mean, for goodness sake, it's main idea! It shouldn't be this much of a struggle by 4th and 5th grade but something is getting lost in translation. Maybe too abstract and not cement enough? Clearly many teachers feel that students struggle with this skill so we have to start from the foundation up. Don't you think? Just some thoughts about things that are standing out to me so far,

This is the first group of ideas that actually stand out to me for teaching main idea that are unique and engaging- not the same old thing! Especially the puzzle piece one, definitely watch the youtube video. This is something that could be used for any age in my mind and tweaked for older students once the basis is established. Let me know!

[] Lauren L.

Lauren Your statement about being meaningless, empty, and losing grasp over time is correct. It may be that the students don't look at the whole piece. They understand the "gist" or topic but they don't realize that a writing may have more than one main idea as the reading sophistication grows. I am interested in seeing the developmental story for main idea. I also believe that somewhere we are dropping the ball. We found in our last lesson study, Metaphorical Thinking, that we were spoon feeding our students by teaching figurative language systematically. We were giving the definition, using stems, and locating key words. When we used the umbrella term, Metaphorical Language, and did not tag the different types of figurative language our students learned to read literature looking for visual language and subsequently adding it into their writing. We named the metaphors, similes .... at the end. It had meaning (the students still remember)! It may be we teach main idea in a rote manner, topic sentences, and the students are not analyzing the information read. Would love to hear what the primary teachers think Kip

I totally agree Lauren and Kip! :) I definitely think we teach this concept in a rote manner. In third grade, we've seen main idea, supporting details, theme, topic etc. The students can usually tell me what the theme or topic is, but when it comes to main idea or supporting details, they are lost. I usually use some kind of organizer to show the "flow" which I admit is boring. I definitely think they need something visual to see though. I guess looking at our developmental story will allow us to see where the ball gets dropped. Looking forward to meeting with you all today :) Stefanie L.